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October 04, 2007



"but if you go too far the next thing you know you’ll be handing out pamphlets in an airport or jumping up and down in a field while wearing a white saffron robe"

Or maybe you'll just turn into Mohatma Gandhi, who weighed less than 120 pounds and defeated the British Empire.

Or maybe you'll just grow the fuck up and realize that real revolution requires stamina at least as much as rage, and that you can Fight the Power longer--like, for decades, instead of 2:00 minutes--if you take care of your body, mind, and spirit.

Or maybe you'll realize that straight-edge--being clean and clear--was an old, old concept; that hardcore punks didn't invent it, and that 4000 years of Hindu culture might have figured out a few things that hardcore hadn't yet.

Or maybe you'll just say uninformed things about stuff you nothing about.

Ya think?


i think Nash Rose was talking more about the group-think mentality, and the crazy places it can lead you to. I didn't take it as an attack upon straight edge as a way of life. Although y'all edgers could lighten up just a little bit. If you don't find that ray cappo = raghunath das shit funny, somethin's wrong with ya!


Yes, it's funny to think of the loudmouth jar-heads from the late 80's (what I often refer to as "yah dudes" for their tendency to say that exact phrase) eventually becoming vegetarians/Hare Krsnas/pacifists/yoga instructors. Confused and angry kids of any era are likely to latch on to whatever group movement gives them some kind of direction, but I'd rather have a VFW hall full of vegans than a VFW hall full of white supremacists.

And I'm not sure what "being yourself" means anymore-- I'm sure there are Young Republicans everywhere who are convinced they are thinking for themselves because they don't listen to "the liberal media" (of course they've just substituted strict conservative dogma for "the liberal media.")

Musically speaking, hardcore was like any other musical style in at least one way-- after the first wave it mostly became codified and boring (think of blues-rock in the 70's, hip hop after 1994, drum-and-bass by 2000)-- only the bands that broke out of the strict rules remain interesting years later. I'm reminded of Miles Davis' put-down of modern bebop as "young guys in suits playing other people's music."


Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. I'm not an edger, and can certainly agree that *any* kind of self-righteous proselytizing is either obnoxious or laughable, depending on your perspective. But, I *was* suggesting that assuming somebody's a flake or a wimp because he gets into yoga is itself pretty ignorant.


Nitpick: Saffron robes are not white. They are saffron. Saffron is a colour.


Re: the video and song "No More"-- so called "message songs" pretty much fail when you cant understand the words of the song.

And boy, they really did a good job syncing up the video to the music, huh?

I'd heard that John Porcell(y) of YOT was actually boozing and puffing herb towards the end of Youth of Today's existence. So much for straight-edge.

Chris R.

The Krishnas are a cult, and a dangerous one. I happen to have just blogged about just this topic a week ago:

Don't even pretend that the Krishnas are mainstream Hindus. For that matter, having been to South Asia, I can't say that Hinduism is a recommended path for treating your fellow human beings well. "Untouchables," anyone?

Punk and cults were supposed to be polar opposites, no? The ethos was even against organized religion, never mind all-encompassing, life-changing totalitarian religion. The Krishnas had Poly Styrene for a while too; considering their misogyny this is shocking and disappointing.

Brian Turner

A bunch of racist asshole punks in my hometown all became Krishnas overnight the day after Ray played a show. Two weeks later they were Deadheads.


Crucial Youth


having spent many sundays jammed into cb matinees watching ray & the other gap-core youth crewers i'll say i was most suspect when he turned krishna... i bailed after the last "shutdown". was it 89/90?

man, that video is making me crave some BACON! best ray scream: "Make A BACONNNNNNNNNNNNN!!!"

thanks Haagen das cappo!


The Krishna's got Laura Logic too, which makes me sad.

fatty jubbo

That video is hilarious. The only thing that comes to mind, and I don't use this word often, is knuckleheads. After a brief flirting with NYHC for its speed and aggression, I was essentially perplexed by it. I'm still fascinated by when I come across something like a Judge record in a used-bin, thinking...What a bunch of knuckleheads!


I like beating people up at hardcore shows. It takes my mind off my tiny, tiny penis.


Jeesus Christ, the kids in that video are young-looking. 'Youth of Today' is right...

Steve PMX

I think there's something bigger going on that hasn't been touched upon really here. If you grew up around these kids in DC during the 80s/90s - going to shows religiously and hanging out with guys like Ray, Ian, Dante and the rest - you would have seen what a positive impact they made on alot of "lost" kids who could have easily gone the route of crime and drugs. But they had these positive role models who showed them that you can pound out some of the most 'aggressive' hardcore music, yet be vegan (if you chose to be) or be straight-edge (if you chose to be) or do whatever else you wanted to do. This toughguy hardcore image of beating people up at random or gaybashing or whatever was put to rest when these guys came on the scene, and that's definitely a great thing. Just my 2c.


There's more to NYHC than what Nash represents in this article. There have been many hardcore crusty and non-straightedge bands in NYC. Those are they ones I like the most. YOT and straightedge was definitely silly in retrospect. But it did have a positive impact on many people. As long as they didn't take it too seriously. Hey, good for Ray. He appears to be happy. It's good to be a non-comformist.


Most people don't think of "cynic" as a group affiliation, yet they all think alike.

Chris R.

"Hey, good for Ray. He appears to be happy. It's good to be a non-comformist."

What?! Is there anything more conformist than a cult..?


Thanks for blowing the lid off the murky world of straight edge and exposing the sinister motives behind this insidious youth cult.


no sehc specific but a great nj shorecore pic w/ some nyhc content (1 bozo's wearing a sick of it all shirt).

it's clobbering time:


that website is bunk, Govinda's and it's owner are great.

straight edge was important. even if people were just being followers when they decided to put the drink and drugs down, they at least get the benefit of sobriety for that part of their life.

if they were fools, they would have just been intoxicated fools otherwise.

"we're not the first, i hope we're not the last....

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